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Cletus Nze

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Is God Omniscient ?
« Reply #105 on: January 18, 2011, 12:52:36 pm »
jbiemans wrote: Your looking at it backwards.  My internet persona has the same knowledge as I have.  It is impossible for me to know something and for my internet persona to not know the same thing.

What you are saying is like saying that my windstar really has a Porsche nature but it cannot express it because it is limited by being in the body of a windstar.  Rather then facing the simple truth, that it actually is a windstar.


Not at all! Your internet persona is you - subjected to the limitations of the internet. There aren't two independent things here - just one! If you perish, so does your internet persona. If your internet persona perishes, you can simply set up another one. But without an internet persona you cannot communicate on the internet! That's about it!

In choosing to incarnate in the flesh, Jesus was subjected to its limits also - with regard to ALL of His Activity in the physical - but ONLY in that regard! No more! His Activity on the Cosmic Scale continued unperturbed - same as you maintain a normal life away from the internet.
Pursue Truth - with rigour and vigour!

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Johan Biemans (jbiemans)

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« Reply #106 on: January 18, 2011, 01:13:24 pm »
but I can only operate one persona at a time, either the internet one or the normal life.  I cannot operate both at the same time.  Also, if what you are saying is true, why would his knowledge be limited ?  You have to take into account that while the tool may limit the actions of the user, it does not limit the user itself.

Its almost as if you are saying that Jesus is playing an MMO, and due to the limits of the game, while he is in the game he is limited (Ie, you cannot do everything you want inside a game.)  While this could be an interesting anology, it proposes that an limitless being can be forcibly limited.

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Cletus Nze

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« Reply #107 on: January 18, 2011, 02:15:37 pm »
jbiemans wrote: but I can only operate one persona at a time, either the internet one or the normal life.  I cannot operate both at the same time.  Also, if what you are saying is true, why would his knowledge be limited ?  You have to take into account that while the tool may limit the actions of the user, it does not limit the user itself.

Its almost as if you are saying that Jesus is playing an MMO, and due to the limits of the game, while he is in the game he is limited (Ie, you cannot do everything you want inside a game.)  While this could be an interesting anology, it proposes that an limitless being can be forcibly limited.


Hahahahahahahahahahahahahaha! Right! So when you're on the internet and the phone rings you don't hear it, eh dolt? Sheeeeeeeeesh! You sure you don't need to see a shrink? Hahahahahahahahahahahahahaha!

God is the Creator! He DOES NOT destroy! Destruction may be wrought via the misuse of His Power by those with Free Will to whom some of It is entrusted but NEVER by His Will! When God chose to enter into the world He could ONLY do so in a way that would not lead to its destruction - which implies He had to accept the limitations to activity therein - which alone allows earthly beings to survive. Just as the limitations here on the planet to mobility - as compared to outer space - allow us to survive, otherwise we should be wiped out very quickly by ionizing radiation and meteorite bombardment!

To continue the analogy, unless you actually wish to compromise a website, you will try and enter it in the legitimate way - and not force your way in, assuming you have the ability to do so, in a way which will damage it or force its shutdown by its operators who are bound to discover their security has been compromised. So, you're forced to accept the restrictions to your activity on the internet imposed by the websites you're visiting. The same was true for Christ in the flesh.
Pursue Truth - with rigour and vigour!

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Johan Biemans (jbiemans)

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« Reply #108 on: January 18, 2011, 03:08:37 pm »
Hahahahahahahahahahahahahaha! Right! So when you're on the internet and the phone rings you don't hear it, eh dolt? Sheeeeeeeeesh! You sure you don't need to see a shrink? Hahahahahahahahahahahahahaha!

Yes I hear the phone, and then STOP writing on the internet.  One thing at a time.  Think of the movie avatar (I cant believe I am using this as a reference).  He could only operate one body at a time.

God is the Creator! He DOES NOT destroy!

Tell that to Sodum and Gemorah.  Are you even trying ?  You are making this too easy.

When God chose to enter into the world He could ONLY do so in a way that would not lead to its destruction - which implies He had to accept the limitations to activity therein - which alone allows earthly beings to survive.

So Jesus was the first time that God entered the world and interacted with humans ???  I guess the whole old testament is made up.

So, you're forced to accept the restrictions to your activity on the internet imposed by the websites you're visiting.

So the being that can do anything, must follow the rules of a system, and is able to have rules imposed upon him, sounds like omnipotent to me !

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wonderer

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« Reply #109 on: January 18, 2011, 04:01:54 pm »

jbiemans wrote: So Jesus was the first time that God entered the world...???

Based on the way M simply declares things to be THE TRUTH, perhaps his birth was the second time?

"The world needed that of us, to maintain—by our example, by our very existence—a world that would keep learning and questioning, that would remain free in thought, inquiry, and word." - Alice Dreger

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Snakeystew

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« Reply #110 on: January 18, 2011, 06:09:45 pm »

God is the Creator! He DOES NOT destroy! Destruction may be wrought via the misuse of His Power by those with Free Will to whom some of It is entrusted but NEVER by His Will!

Consider gods creation: who, for instance, can straighten what god has bent? When things are going well, enjoy yourself, and when they are going badly, consider this: god has designed the one no less than the other so that we should take nothing for granted Ecclesiastes 7:13

Is it not from the mouth of the Most High that good and evil come?
Lam. 3:38

For thus saith the Lord; as I have brought all this great evil upon this people, so will I bring upon them all the good that I have promised them Jer. 32:42

...shall there be evil in a city, and the Lord hath not done it? Amos 3:6

I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these things Is. 45:7



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Dan Stewart

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« Reply #111 on: January 18, 2011, 10:53:06 pm »
jbiemans wrote:
And if it was maintained that God couldn't become a man, you'd argue that He wasn't omnipotent. If one said He didn't know how, you'd argue that He wasn't omniscient. I don't see your game as terribly clever.

Actually if you define omnipotent as having the potential to do anything logically possible, and God becoming man is logically impossible, then I see no contradiction with God being omnipotent and not becoming man.

But in Scofferland, using a proper definition of 'omnipotent' is no more allowed than using a proper definition of 'omniscient', as you yourself are demonstrating right here, right now.
"P.S. Oct 22d. Hen. has taken your M.S. to London, & will write.— I have lately read Morley's Life of Voltaire & he insists strongly that direct attacks on Christianity (even when written with the wonderful force & vigour of Voltaire) produce little permanent effect: real good seems only to follow f

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Snakeystew

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« Reply #112 on: January 18, 2011, 10:56:46 pm »
But in Scofferland, using a proper definition of 'omnipotent' is no more allowed than using a proper definition of 'omniscient'


Kindly provide that proper definition now. It would save future error. Thank you muchly.