kurros

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Circularity of belief in God via 'sensus divinitatis'
« on: January 20, 2014, 11:08:18 pm »
Hi there,

So I have recently read Platinga's argument that "the de jure question is not independent of the de facto question" (http://www.ccel.org/ccel/plantinga/warrant3.vi.i.iii.html), in which he basically concludes that if God exists, belief in him is warranted (because 'sensus divinitatis' is then a valid method of gaining knowledge), and conversely if he doesn't exist, then such belief is not warranted, and 'sensus divinitatis' is a hallucination.

I am almost happy with this argument, but there is one point that concerns me. It seems kind of circular, on the positive side. The argument claims that if God exists then everyone essentially already knows it deep down due to 'sensus divinitatis', which implies to me that no further proof is necessary in this case. However, since 'sensus divinitatis' is a hallucination if God does not exist, there is a risk that one is misled by this sense. To be confident of its validity, one must already know God exists. So one needs some reason to believe this that is independent of 'sensus divinitatis' to avoid circularity. Yet Platinga seems to be trying to argue that 'sensus divinitatis' is all one needs.

So how is the circularity removed? So far the argument seems to prove that 'sensus divinitatis' is not by itself sufficient to produce a warranted belief in God.

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MichaelMullens

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Re: Circularity of belief in God via 'sensus divinitatis'
« Reply #1 on: February 06, 2014, 10:37:31 pm »
Well this inner sense of spirituality is what drives my passion for my beliefs. Throughout history people looked to the heavens for approval and guidance; until it was made clear they never knew who they were looking for but they all knew within them that we had purpose, we had rules and we had an authority even higher then us. Unless every man and woman is psychotically delusional in our inner passion for purpose and life; morality and justice and everything that creates our spirituality I'd like to believe we have ample reasons for logical faith in everything Jesus taught.

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FNB - Former non-believer

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Re: Circularity of belief in God via 'sensus divinitatis'
« Reply #2 on: February 16, 2014, 11:42:26 pm »
Hi there,

So I have recently read Platinga's argument that "the de jure question is not independent of the de facto question" (http://www.ccel.org/ccel/plantinga/warrant3.vi.i.iii.html), in which he basically concludes that if God exists, belief in him is warranted (because 'sensus divinitatis' is then a valid method of gaining knowledge), and conversely if he doesn't exist, then such belief is not warranted, and 'sensus divinitatis' is a hallucination.

I am almost happy with this argument, but there is one point that concerns me. It seems kind of circular, on the positive side. The argument claims that if God exists then everyone essentially already knows it deep down due to 'sensus divinitatis', which implies to me that no further proof is necessary in this case. However, since 'sensus divinitatis' is a hallucination if God does not exist, there is a risk that one is misled by this sense. To be confident of its validity, one must already know God exists. So one needs some reason to believe this that is independent of 'sensus divinitatis' to avoid circularity. Yet Platinga seems to be trying to argue that 'sensus divinitatis' is all one needs.

So how is the circularity removed? So far the argument seems to prove that 'sensus divinitatis' is not by itself sufficient to produce a warranted belief in God.

I think you are comparing the actual world with the world exactly the same and there is no God. For example, perhaps if there was no God, there wouldn't be any life at all. If there is a God, then the sensus divinitatis is not a hallucination. If there is no God, perhaps there wouldn't even be a sensus divinitatus. I think part of the concept of the sensus divinitatus is that it is self-justifying much like our physical senses (touch, hearing, etc…) we cannot prove that these are reliable but we just kind of know that they are… or at least we are rational to accept that they are even if there is a possibility that we are wrong.

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jayceeii

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Re: Circularity of belief in God via 'sensus divinitatis'
« Reply #3 on: January 20, 2020, 10:26:07 am »
You don’t need a “sensus divinitatis,” instead empiricism and faith come together if the soul is examined. Men are not doing this because it is immensely difficult and such knowledge comes only in tiny stages. If the soul is seen and known, then you know the external God exists because the marks of the Creator’s hand are found therein. Such a science has not been begun in any of the religions, but one place to start is identifying and cataloging the powers of the mind. Again, even the most advanced human gurus simply use the mind, without examining it, like drivers pressing the accelerator but ignoring the engine, therefore these gurus universally declare there is no external God. However there are a few gurus who interlace teachings about the external God in their works which otherwise can seem similar to this lower class of gurus, and these have seen the soul.

The idea behind a “sensus diviniatatis” is that any man would be equipped to inquire about the existence of the external Deity, but such is not the case. No such sense exists, and the lower class of gurus are one of the proofs, very advanced in discourse but very poor in spiritual experience. Generally men who think they see or “feel” God, are mislabeling varied mental phenomena ultimately springing from themselves, not God.

I’ve come to calling this higher class the “cognoscenti,” because they are knowers. They may not have direct spiritual experiences, but the marks of this inner knowledge are seen in their lives, the way the Bible says the good will be known by their works. In general this class can understand higher principles, and live in a higher mode that is based in spiritual reality rather than sensate reactivity. So far, they remain in hiding among men.