General Discussion

Choose Your Own Topic

Read 7049 times

Crash Test

  • *****
  • 20719 Posts
    • View Profile
Re: Athiests-- Why are you here?
« Reply #30 on: August 30, 2016, 02:35:47 am »

"So you don't like the Harry Potter analogy.  That's fine."

No I don't.

And no it's not.

The fact that you don't seem to understand why that's a problem is the issue I addressed in my initial post.  Thanks for making my point for me.

I'm confused, the Harry Potter analogy was your analogy.  AiL just explained why it didn't quite fit.

I was about to type a really long post explaining why I came and am still here, because the OP seemed genuinely inquisitive.  But AiL gave you a long and reasoned set of responses, and then you attacked him for using the example that you yourself had provided?
-- This user will return on the twenty-fourth of July --

1

AnimatedDirt

  • ****
  • 7821 Posts
  • Alwys a sinner, Alwys penitent, Alwys right w/ God
    • View Profile
Re: Athiests-- Why are you here?
« Reply #31 on: August 30, 2016, 10:07:27 am »
It's to try and explain that even though the bible says that I know that god exists, that I actually don't.

The more charitable interpretation is to say that you ( atheists/non-believers ) insist that you know better, but all that you do know...is that you don't want "god"...you don't need "god"...you're a god unto yourself.  Self is your god and Science is your god...and you don't see that it is because you're ( atheists and non-believers ) too busy pointing out that believers are irrational and deluded in faith...when you have no proof of your own beliefs!

That's the point of the biblical claim.  You don't know God, but not for lack of knowledge, it's for lack of want, desire, and especially NEED...

...and then when the gavel drops, "God is unfair!!..."
People are amusing.

2

ATheisticSeeker

  • ***
  • 2442 Posts
    • View Profile
Re: Athiests-- Why are you here?
« Reply #32 on: August 30, 2016, 10:15:07 am »
It's to try and explain that even though the bible says that I know that god exists, that I actually don't.

The more charitable interpretation is to say that you ( atheists/non-believers ) insist that you know better, but all that you do know...is that you don't want "god"...you don't need "god"...you're a god unto yourself.  Self is your god and Science is your god...and you don't see that it is because you're ( atheists and non-believers ) too busy pointing out that believers are irrational and deluded in faith...when you have no proof of your own beliefs!

That's the point of the biblical claim.  You don't know God, but not for lack of knowledge, it's for lack of want, desire, and especially NEED...

...and then when the gavel drops, "God is unfair!!..."


My theory (or "hunch") is that God's perfectly just nature will be so abundantly clear and apparent that no one will feel "cheated" if they're sentenced to hell.
My counsel shall stand, and I will do all my pleasure:

3

AnimatedDirt

  • ****
  • 7821 Posts
  • Alwys a sinner, Alwys penitent, Alwys right w/ God
    • View Profile
Re: Athiests-- Why are you here?
« Reply #33 on: August 30, 2016, 10:27:13 am »
It's to try and explain that even though the bible says that I know that god exists, that I actually don't.

The more charitable interpretation is to say that you ( atheists/non-believers ) insist that you know better, but all that you do know...is that you don't want "god"...you don't need "god"...you're a god unto yourself.  Self is your god and Science is your god...and you don't see that it is because you're ( atheists and non-believers ) too busy pointing out that believers are irrational and deluded in faith...when you have no proof of your own beliefs!

That's the point of the biblical claim.  You don't know God, but not for lack of knowledge, it's for lack of want, desire, and especially NEED...

...and then when the gavel drops, "God is unfair!!..."


My theory (or "hunch") is that God's perfectly just nature will be so abundantly clear and apparent that no one will feel "cheated" if they're sentenced to hell.

I find that a pretty difficult stance to hold in light of the Satan character being the "leader" of these people.  Certainly you don't believe he's simply gonna lay back and say, "Oh well...I did my best, but in the end, I deserve what I get..."?
People are amusing.

4

aleph naught

  • ****
  • 7392 Posts
  • For the glory of the Canadian empire.
    • View Profile
Re: Athiests-- Why are you here?
« Reply #34 on: August 30, 2016, 10:34:29 am »
And I don't mean this as an attack, but as a serious question.

I'm absolutely perplexed by the amount of time and number of posts many of the atheists devote to this Christian philosophy website.  I see many atheist posters with post counts in the multiple thousands, commenting on virtually every thread, often dwarfing the post counts of their theist counterparts. 

Furthermore, the atheist posters are found to be frequently complaining about the quality of the board, the quality of the theist posters, and the intellectual vacuousness of the founder of the forums. 

Can someone explain this mentality to me?  I don't like Harry Potter, so I don't frequent Harry Potter forums.  I don't like the New York Knicks, so I don't find myself on New York Knicks forums.  I don't go onto Twilight forums and belittle the readers, or put down the author.  On occasion I will go on a Buddhist forum, or a Hindu forum, I'll read some topics, possibly ask a question, maybe respond, and then I leave. 

I don't understand the thought process involved in being a constant forum presence while continuing to attack every aspect of the board, and I can't be the only one that notices that the most vocal atheist posters also seem to be the most unhappy with their fellow posters, the topics, Christian philosophy, and Craig himself. 

I would assume that if you have multiple thousands of posts, you enjoy the board, other posters, some of the topics, and have at least some mild respect for Craig.  But I just don't get that sense here. 

Am I wrong?  What am I missing?

Atheists tend to like truth (sharing and defending it) and epistemic virtue. I guess we're just some kind of epistemic saints.

5

Asherah-deceased

  • ***
  • 2486 Posts
    • View Profile
Re: Athiests-- Why are you here?
« Reply #35 on: August 30, 2016, 10:53:46 am »
I hear to learn something, and I hop to help others learn something.  We learn much more by engaging with those we disagree with.

What have you learned in your time here?  Serious question.
I've learned a lot about philosophy. 

6

Hawke123

  • ***
  • 2415 Posts
  • So much to learn so little time
    • View Profile
Re: Athiests-- Why are you here?
« Reply #36 on: August 30, 2016, 11:22:47 am »
My theory (or "hunch") is that God's perfectly just nature will be so abundantly clear and apparent that no one will feel "cheated" if they're sentenced to hell.
I beg to differ.  There will be "weeping and gnashing of teeth".
"A mind needs books as a sword needs a whetstone, if it is to keep its edge." -- Tyrion Lannister

“It is always so much easier to attack someone else's position than to create and defend your own.” – Glenn Miller

7

ATheisticSeeker

  • ***
  • 2442 Posts
    • View Profile
Re: Athiests-- Why are you here?
« Reply #37 on: August 30, 2016, 01:17:42 pm »
My theory (or "hunch") is that God's perfectly just nature will be so abundantly clear and apparent that no one will feel "cheated" if they're sentenced to hell.
I beg to differ.  There will be "weeping and gnashing of teeth".


You think they'll go into the fire still thinking they're innocent, good people?  And that God is being mean and unjust?
My counsel shall stand, and I will do all my pleasure:

8

AnimatedDirt

  • ****
  • 7821 Posts
  • Alwys a sinner, Alwys penitent, Alwys right w/ God
    • View Profile
Re: Athiests-- Why are you here?
« Reply #38 on: August 30, 2016, 01:23:07 pm »
My theory (or "hunch") is that God's perfectly just nature will be so abundantly clear and apparent that no one will feel "cheated" if they're sentenced to hell.
I beg to differ.  There will be "weeping and gnashing of teeth".

You think they'll go into the fire still thinking they're innocent, good people?  And that God is being mean and unjust?

Absolutely.   It's human nature!
People are amusing.

9

Hawke123

  • ***
  • 2415 Posts
  • So much to learn so little time
    • View Profile
Re: Athiests-- Why are you here?
« Reply #39 on: August 30, 2016, 02:56:09 pm »
My theory (or "hunch") is that God's perfectly just nature will be so abundantly clear and apparent that no one will feel "cheated" if they're sentenced to hell.
I beg to differ.  There will be "weeping and gnashing of teeth".


You think they'll go into the fire still thinking they're innocent, good people?  And that God is being mean and unjust?
More like they'll be forced to realize the foolishness and depravity of their choices, and the fact that they'll have nobody to blame but themselves.
"A mind needs books as a sword needs a whetstone, if it is to keep its edge." -- Tyrion Lannister

“It is always so much easier to attack someone else's position than to create and defend your own.” – Glenn Miller

10

Nunovalente

  • ***
  • 3859 Posts
    • View Profile
Re: Athiests-- Why are you here?
« Reply #40 on: August 30, 2016, 03:11:50 pm »
Id be interested in how many atheists are on atheist forums and spend as much time on them as they do on here.

I think part of the reason atheists are on here is because they think atheism is right, and theism is wrong.
And they have to tell theists and show them they are wrong. Because what is right must be upheld, and what is wrong must be stopped.
But this presupposes a right and wrong in the first place. So it does baffle me why relativists who deny OMV&D as so determined in their arguments, defending what is right, and defeating what is wrong.

If only others would realise what CS Lewis did when he really considered his own motives.
“My argument against God was that the universe seemed so cruel and unjust. But how had I got this idea of just and unjust? A man does not call a line crooked unless he has some idea of a straight line. What was I comparing this universe with when I called it unjust?”
Faith is being confident in things hoped for, the conviction of facts not yet seen. Hebrews 11.
Everyone exercises faith in something. What is your faith in?

11

Atheist in Louisiana

  • ***
  • 2631 Posts
  • I ain't afraid of no ghost!
    • View Profile
    • Atheist in Louisiana
Re: Athiests-- Why are you here?
« Reply #41 on: August 30, 2016, 07:54:04 pm »
It's to try and explain that even though the bible says that I know that god exists, that I actually don't.

The more charitable interpretation is to say that you ( atheists/non-believers ) insist that you know better, but all that you do know...is that you don't want "god"...you don't need "god"...you're a god unto yourself.  Self is your god and Science is your god...and you don't see that it is because you're ( atheists and non-believers ) too busy pointing out that believers are irrational and deluded in faith...when you have no proof of your own beliefs!

That's the point of the biblical claim.  You don't know God, but not for lack of knowledge, it's for lack of want, desire, and especially NEED...

...and then when the gavel drops, "God is unfair!!..."

That makes absolutely no sense.

It isn't more charitable for me to say things that are untrue in an attempt to make it look as though you actually understand my position, when you don't and I'm attempting to show you that you don't.  That would be entirely counter-productive.

Lying to you about what I actually do and don't know in effort to make you look good isn't charitable in any way.  Stop trolling.
Had the magazine not published these cartoons, they would not have been specifically targeted.
Consequences, AiL, consequences. - Jenna Black

Hey, if you want to, I'm more than ok with it.  :)  I love the attention. - Questions11

12

bdsimon

  • ****
  • 7047 Posts
  • δοῦλος
    • View Profile
Re: Athiests-- Why are you here?
« Reply #42 on: August 30, 2016, 08:38:42 pm »
If you ask me, a far better question to ask atheists is "why are we here?"
Let your conversation be always full of grace, seasoned with salt, so that you may know how to answer everyone.

13

Jenna Black

  • ***
  • 2806 Posts
  • Truth is worth pursuing.
    • View Profile
Re: Athiests-- Why are you here?
« Reply #43 on: August 30, 2016, 08:40:33 pm »
If you ask me, a far better question to ask atheists is "why are we here?"
Ah, yes, the great transcendental question.
Philippians 4:8 Finally, brethren, whatsoever things are true, whatsoever things are honest, whatsoever things are just, whatsoever things are pure, whatsoever things are lovely, whatsoever things are of good report; if there be any virtue, and if there be any praise, think on these things.

14

AnimatedDirt

  • ****
  • 7821 Posts
  • Alwys a sinner, Alwys penitent, Alwys right w/ God
    • View Profile
Re: Athiests-- Why are you here?
« Reply #44 on: August 31, 2016, 08:54:15 am »
It's to try and explain that even though the bible says that I know that god exists, that I actually don't.

The more charitable interpretation is to say that you ( atheists/non-believers ) insist that you know better, but all that you do know...is that you don't want "god"...you don't need "god"...you're a god unto yourself.  Self is your god and Science is your god...and you don't see that it is because you're ( atheists and non-believers ) too busy pointing out that believers are irrational and deluded in faith...when you have no proof of your own beliefs!

That's the point of the biblical claim.  You don't know God, but not for lack of knowledge, it's for lack of want, desire, and especially NEED...

...and then when the gavel drops, "God is unfair!!..."

That makes absolutely no sense.

It isn't more charitable for me to say things that are untrue in an attempt to make it look as though you actually understand my position, when you don't and I'm attempting to show you that you don't.  That would be entirely counter-productive.

Lying to you about what I actually do and don't know in effort to make you look good isn't charitable in any way.  Stop trolling.

You're so lost.  It's not me trying to interpret YOUR position, but rather the interpretation of what the bible is saying.

The easy words are these;  Outspoken atheists know they have no proof of atheism...and so it is on the authority of self and/or science they rest their position, again, neither of which provides their cherished proofs.  No different to Christians.
People are amusing.